In my previous post about Newtown, I noted that some people were pointing to an absence or rejection of god as a reason for this horrible thing happening. I said I would not give it credence, and I mean that. I will not even link to examples of it here. You can do a quick google search and find many examples. Here I will detail why I think that attitude has no place in any dialogue and an explanation of why I think people need to start really pushing back against that attitude and those bigoted behaviors.
Let’s begin with an absence of proof. There is no proof of any god actually existing. Widespread belief =/= proof. We can not compile data, employ the empirical method, or gather statistics because there is no measurable or real and observable data. I fail to see how pointing a finger at something that can not be measured, observed, or changed in quantifiable ways is helpful or productive. Beyond that, since the dominant religion in America is Christianity and since the people speaking most loudly about this are Christians, what does that mean?
It means they are bigoted assholes. That’s what it means.
The idea being put forth here is that it is the rejection of the Christian God that has brought this upon us. Why do we tolerate that nonsense? Atheists, Jews, Muslims, everybody that isn’t Christian…are you ok with this attitude? They aren’t talking about your God, they are only talking about theirs. They do not think you all believe in the same god and they do believe that your god is the wrong one. Atheist or humanist? Forget about it. To them, you are instigators of this phenomenon. The types of statements being made by some Christians that an absence of god is at the forefront of this occurring insinuates that:
1. Absence of Christian God results in mass shootings.
2. Presence of other faiths, atheism and humanism are responsible for shootings
3. Their god kills children in schools to illustrate that he belongs in schools.
This is so stupid, bigoted and offensive. More people need to start getting offended by these statements on the basis of their bigotry and prejudice and to push back against it than to even criticize it for the lack of sense that it makes. Yes, it’s illogical. Also, it’s really bigoted agaisnt non-christians and non-believers. There needs to be push back and opposition to the statements, not just on the basis of these statments being illogical and unproveable, but on the very discriminatory bigoted, and prejudicial nature of them. They scapegoat all other belief systems as ‘other’ and cast them in a deviant light. I am appalled that this shit gets said and the general outcry seems to be one of ‘NUH UH! GOD IS LOVING!’ and not more of ‘Your bigoted bullshit will not stand’. This Christian privilege should not go unchecked.
It won’t stand. Speak up, push back, let it be known. This shit is idotic and we will not put up with it.
And if your god is so weak and pitiful that he can’t stop massacres in schools unless we pray to him in schools…he’s not really much of a god, is he? If his way of showing displeasure at abortion (yes, that’s been said) is to allow somebody or inspire somebody to shoot up a school, your god might be an asshole.
Larry
/ December 20, 2012AMEN. A big amen.
Michele
/ December 20, 2012Sara this is just SO right on, I would say more, but there has already been a long thread about this on a friend’s Facebook page, and I have exhausted myself trying to be reasonable with the godless-nation-handwringers that have been all over social media the past few days.
Once someone brought abortion into it (“What is so hard for me to understand is the same people that are preaching about the violent video games and movies are the same people that go and have abortions-Are you saying that’s not violent murder.” after she wrote “We have three boys who love guns and love war. I love this about them. This is how God created man.”), I had to bow out before my brain exploded.
Sara
/ December 21, 2012It’s really hard to try and have a logic-based discussion with people that don’t think or act logically.
And I’m really, really tired of fetuses being called babies and abortion being referred to as murder. This is why I speak about it loudly and often and is a perfect example of how the language we use affects common perception.
Michele
/ December 21, 2012“It’s really hard to try and have a logic-based discussion with people that don’t think or act logically.”
Truer words, my friend, truer words…..
Laura
/ December 20, 2012Please know that a lot of Christians (like myself) are also very disgusted by the “absence of God” argument for the reason behind things like the Sandy Hook tragedy. These people, sadly, make the Christian God look terrible – as you so very well show in your post. Do you know the Christian author Rachel Held Evans? She’s a “progressive” more open minded type of Christian. You might appreciate a recent post she has on this very issue: http://rachelheldevans.com/blog/god-kept-out
Sara
/ December 21, 2012Oh, absolutely! And I’m sorry if I didn’t make that clear in the initial post. I certainly, 100% absolutely do not think all Christians feel this way. Not at all! I think just the ones that are saying it and agreeing with it do, and the appropriate response is for all people of other faiths or non-faiths need to speak out in opposition to this because it is bigoted and prejudiced. Christians who oppose these ideas, as ally’s, should do the same. And the message shouldn’t be that it isn’t true about God, but that we will not tolerate such open bigoted and discriminatory language about people who believe something other than the speaker.
robin claire
/ December 21, 2012Speaking from a Christian point of view Sara; what can I say to this?
No one yet seems to be able to outwardly “quantify” and “test” what happens to the interior of a person’s mind and heart, when they allow Christ into their sphere. I myself was changed dramatically – on the inside – when I accepted faith in Jesus. But there is not way to PHYSICALLY test this with worldly measurements. – and this is very sad. I wish the changes wrought inside a person who allows Jesus in, could be “tested”. Maybe some day it will be.
I can’t speak for other’s religious experiences however, because their mind and heart changes can not be “tested” either. So I must leave all the “testing” and “proving” up to God – who the Bible says can “test the heart”. (sigh of sadness right now)
love to you,
robin claire
Sara
/ December 21, 2012If doesn’t matter if they can or cannot or even if god is or is not real. What matters is that there are people who are very much in the public eye that are saying things that are discriminatory and prejudiced against non-christians, and they’re getting away with it because christianity is the dominant religion in America. The opposition from people of faith needs to move beyond ‘God isn’t like that’ and into the realm of ‘We will not tolerate your bigoted and oppressive language’.
BroadBlogs
/ December 21, 2012Seems like a number of mass killings were committed in the Bible Belt.
collegefemmenist
/ December 21, 2012One of the worst things I have seen was a (former) Facebook friend asking why the massacre of those innocents upsets the American people but not the massacre of innocents through abortion.
The Arbourist
/ December 23, 2012The anti-choice dedication to “preserving life” doesn’t seem to have a bottom on as far low they will stoop to promote their message. Making hay for your anti-woman platform on the deaths of 20 children and 6 adults is disgusting.
And some contend they hold the “moral high-ground”. My arse. I called four anti-choicers on their BS. Not one retracted their macabre position using mass-murder to further their fatuous bull-cookery.
marlenegalea
/ December 22, 2012Funny how Christians sometimes are at their most Unchristian when ‘proving’ their God is around.
I think it comes from the uncomfortable place of trying to believe that: God is all-knowing. He is all-powerful. And He loves all his creatures….and to then try to bring logic into the equation.
(You may find my post here of interest: http://confessionsofachocolateeater.wordpress.com/2012/12/03/a-theological-question/)
thäran
/ December 22, 2012One of the best observations I’ve seen was: “This country was founded on the killing of innocent children, particularly black, brown and red. Right now, U.S. drones are killing innocent children in the Middle East. What happened today in Connecticut is terrible and heartbreaking. But in the midst of all the usual media jibberish about monsters toting guns, let’s remember that violence against children is perpetuated at every level of American existence, every day. We only get outraged when the children look like the babies who died today.” ~ Black Girl Dangerous.
thäran
/ December 22, 2012[Sorry had a lapse of attention] I haven’t read a lot about it but I’m only hearing of this aspect in the last 2 days, before that the media was all about Autism (a photo campaign is happening) and that Lanza was vegan (but I haven’t checked what kind of publication Salon is). So it seems they’ll shift the media frenzy to detract from real issues and the apathy around other tragedies. The conspiracists are doing a brilliant job too.